Live Blog the Committee of Action Meeting Regarding the Reallocation of Resources

April 2009
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Posted on April 29, 2009 by travjohnson

EDITED TO INCLUDE TRANSCRIPT OF LIVE BLOGGING EVENT. LIVE BLOGGING TEXT IS INCLUDED AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS POST. Stats from the Live Blogging Event = 167 replies and 5,684 views in about 3 hours.

Join me on Actscelerate to Live Blog the Committee of Action’s Reallocation of Resources Meeting. If you don’t want to participate on Actscelerate, use this thread to share your thoughts. I’ll be back and forth on both but primarily on Actscelerate. The thread I’ll be using there is:

http://www.actscelerate.com/viewtopic.php?t=45906

To watch the Committee of Action’s deliberation on the Reallocation of Resources, follow this link:

http://www.leeuniversity.edu/video/default.aspx

The Schedule is as follows:

Session One: Thursday, April 30, 2:00 – 4:30 p.m.

Session Two: Thursday 7:00 – 9:30 p.m.

Session Three: Friday, May 1, 9:00 – 11:30 a.m.

Session Four: 1:30 – 4:00 p.m. (if necessary)

All times are Eastern Standard Time (EST).

LIVE BLOGGING EVENT FROM ACTSCELERATE BELOW.

Live Blog the Reallocation of Resources Committee of Action Meeting Here. Share your thoughts, quote speakers, share your commentary as we go here in this thread by replying to this thread.

Live Streaming Meeting:
http://www.leeuniversity.edu/video/default.aspx

SCHEDULE:

Quote:

Session One: Thursday, April 30, 2:00 – 4:30 p.m.

Session Two: Thursday 7:00 – 9:30 p.m.

Session Three: Friday, May 1, 9:00 – 11:30 a.m.

Session Four: 1:30 – 4:00 p.m. (if necessary)

All times are Eastern Standard Time (EST).

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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 4091
Yesterday at 10:20 pm

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I have a funeral and revival that conflict with the meetings

David Jenkins

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David Jenkins Friendly Face Joined: 01 Mar 2006 Posts: 140
Posted: Today at 9:09 am Post subject: I have a funeral and revival that conflict with the meetings
Can I watch them later?		Friendly Face Posts: 140 Today at 9:09 am

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Re: I have a funeral and revival that conflict with the meet

Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 9:20 am Post subject: Re: I have a funeral and revival that conflict with the meet

David Jenkins wrote:

Can I watch them later?

Someone would need to be able to rip the video. That can be done. But, someone would need to have the time and the know how to do it.

Any takers?
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 4091
Today at 9:20 am

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 1:12 pm Post subject:

THE BIG QUESTION being asked right now is:

“How much authority does the Committee of Action have?

CONSIDERATION:
– Can the COA Ordain Women as Ordained Bishops?

No. It cannot operate outside the authority given to it by the General Assembly. The COA must operate within the confines of the parameters of Raymond Cupepper’s Motion to Refer the entire measure including the Substitute Motion (perfecting the Substitute Motion):

Quote:

RAYMOND CULPEPPER’S MOTION:
That the entire measure, including the Substitute Motion, be referred to the International Executive Committee in conjunction with the Council of 18, after an impact report on World Missions, an impact study on the International Offices (both finances and personnel), and a workable schedule of reduction down to 10%. Further, that the Executive Council and World Missions leadership and representatives from the states as appointed by the General Overseer function as a committee of action to perfect the model of reallocation as stated in the Substitute Motion and that said motion be announced by September 2009 and enacted by September 2010.

MY SUBSTITUTE MOTION:
That beginning September 1, 2008, local churches shall gradually reduce the total mandatory contributions over five years to state and international headquarters from 15% to 10% with the reduction to be shared equally among State Offices, International Offices and World Missions.

Reduction Schedule:

September 1, 2008-14%
September 1, 2009-13%
September 1, 2010-12%
September 1, 2011-11%
September 1, 2012-10%

Further, that all references to our financial structure be adjusted to reflect these changes.

Any changes to the mandates of the General Assembly outside of the model as laid out in my motion (Ordaining women as Bishops, altering the Declaration of Faith, or disbanding the Evangelism and Home Missions Dept/Budget, etc…) is outside the scope of this motion and outside the authority of the Committee of Action to enact.

The Big Question that will be answered by this committee is “How honored and respected is the authority of the General Assembly?” We already know that the General Assembly’s authority has been subverted in the spending of the EHM Budget. Will there be a further attempt to subvert that authority by completely eliminating a Budget/Department that is not even addressed in the model of Reallocation as laid out in the Substitute Motion embraced by the General Council 950-625 and affirmed by the General Assembly? We’ll see.
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 4091
Today at 1:12 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 1:22 pm Post subject:
Also, I was told this morning by a member of the Committee of Action, “We cannot survive unless we unify the budgets.” This Committee of Action is poised to consolidate the World Missions with International Offices, the very thing the General Assembly reacted so negatively against. This too is outside the scope of the parameters of the Motion to Refer. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 1:22 pm

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conquistador

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conquistador Acts-celerater Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 930
Posted: Today at 1:39 pm Post subject:
bump _________________ Romanos 8:37 37 Sin embargo, en todo esto somos más que vencedores por medio de aquel que nos amó.		Acts-celerater Posts: 930 Today at 1:39 pm

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rsskypastor

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rsskypastor Acts Enthusiast Joined: 24 Jan 2006 Posts: 1545
Posted: Today at 1:44 pm Post subject:
I am anxiously waiting for it to start. _________________ Rushing Wind My Space Scott Simms		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1545 Today at 1:44 pm

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Unified Budget

Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
Posted: Today at 1:53 pm Post subject: Unified Budget
I personally think that a unified budget in Cleveland and a unified budget at regional offices, both with tansparency so that we can keep leaders accountable is needed. We are one denomination.		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 1:53 pm

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Re: Unified Budget

Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: Unified Budget

Billy Humphrey wrote:

I personally think that a unified budget in Cleveland and a unified budget at regional offices, both with tansparency so that we can keep leaders accountable is needed. We are one denomination.

The problem is that action is outside of the scope of the parameters given to the Committee of Action.
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 4091
Today at 1:57 pm

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onlyonepurpose

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onlyonepurpose Friendly Face Joined: 19 Jan 2009 Posts: 200
Posted: Today at 1:58 pm Post subject:
Does anyone have a connection yet? Mine is still looping, trying to connect		Friendly Face Posts: 200 Today at 1:58 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 2:04 pm Post subject:
Raymond Culpepper opened. Paul Conn is greeting people in no official role other than as President of the University and host of the event. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 2:04 pm

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onlyonepurpose

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onlyonepurpose Friendly Face Joined: 19 Jan 2009 Posts: 200
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I am unable to connect.		Friendly Face Posts: 200 Today at 2:06 pm

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
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We are blessed to have Paul Conn in the COG.		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 2:07 pm

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onlyonepurpose

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onlyonepurpose Friendly Face Joined: 19 Jan 2009 Posts: 200
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I am flippin teed! I rearranged my schedule for this and it will not connect!!!		Friendly Face Posts: 200 Today at 2:08 pm

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conquistador
Acts-celerater

Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 930

Posted: Today at 2:08 pm Post subject:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

I am unable to connect.

try clicking on the 100k link. If it doesn’t work, try a different browser.
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Romanos 8:37
37 Sin embargo, en todo esto somos más que vencedores por medio de aquel que nos amó.

Acts-celerater
Posts: 930
Today at 2:08 pm

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onlyonepurpose
Friendly Face

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 200

Posted: Today at 2:10 pm Post subject:

conquistador wrote:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

I am unable to connect.

try clicking on the 100k link. If it doesn’t work, try a different browser.

I did that . I have it on two monitors each running a different speed. I’m trying good old fashioned explorer now.

Friendly Face
Posts: 200
Today at 2:10 pm

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21 Page Reallocation Report

Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
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http://www.faithnews.cc/2009/04/30/executive-council-adopts-reallocation-of-resources-report/		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 2:10 pm

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They have the power to perfect the motion

KevinWallace

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KevinWallace Friendly Face Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 105
Posted: Today at 2:13 pm Post subject: They have the power to perfect the motion
That is the answer to the question… Let’s not make more of the authority issue than is there. We want change, let’s let the Committee flow in their authority that we gave them through the General Assembly _________________ Once I thought was wrong, but…I was mistaken Last edited by KevinWallace on 4/30/09 2:15 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 105 Today at 2:13 pm

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onlyonepurpose

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onlyonepurpose Friendly Face Joined: 19 Jan 2009 Posts: 200
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That’s it. I quit. I hope you all enjoy it. I will read the blogs later. After rearranging my schedule, its a no go…so I guess I will take my kids to the park…its a nice day.		Friendly Face Posts: 200 Today at 2:14 pm

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conquistador
Acts-celerater

Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 930

Posted: Today at 2:14 pm Post subject:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

conquistador wrote:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

I am unable to connect.

try clicking on the 100k link. If it doesn’t work, try a different browser.

I did that . I have it on two monitors each running a different speed. I’m trying good old fashioned explorer now.

Any luck? I’m on firefox and its working.

whats that thing

aprilmay

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aprilmay Friendly Face Joined: 05 Jan 2009 Posts: 209
Posted: Today at 2:15 pm Post subject: whats that thing
in culpeppers ear? is he part of the Secret service?		Friendly Face Posts: 209 Today at 2:15 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 2:21 pm Post subject:
where is the report – can’t find it…just see the preamble _________________ www.rpfield.com		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 2:21 pm

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onlyonepurpose

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onlyonepurpose
Friendly Face

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 200

Posted: Today at 2:21 pm Post subject:

conquistador wrote:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

conquistador wrote:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

I am unable to connect.

try clicking on the 100k link. If it doesn’t work, try a different browser.

I did that . I have it on two monitors each running a different speed. I’m trying good old fashioned explorer now.

Any luck? I’m on firefox and its working.

Nope. I even downloaded Internet Explorer hoping that would help…I think its my firewall server here at the church…it takes my IT firm days to get out here…oh well. I will read the blogs.

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 2:22 pm Post subject:

Shane B. Stone wrote:

where is the report – can’t find it…just see the preamble

I can’t find it either
_________________
Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
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Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 2453
Today at 2:22 pm

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right after you click on the

aprilmay

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aprilmay Friendly Face Joined: 05 Jan 2009 Posts: 209
Posted: Today at 2:25 pm Post subject: right after you click on the
icon for the meeting, click on the name of the report. its the first thing on the screen		Friendly Face Posts: 209 Today at 2:25 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
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http://churchofgod.org/uploads/Report%20of%20Ex%20Council%20to%20CofA.pdf _________________ www.rpfield.com		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 2:26 pm

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
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http://churchofgod.org/reallocation-of-resources-meeting-set/ then click on the link at the top		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 2:28 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers Acts Enthusiast Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 2453 Location: Tampa FL
Posted: Today at 2:31 pm Post subject:
I read the report.. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it looks like they are cutting out world missions by reducing the amount sent by churches to 0%. It seems they are replacing it with a love offering to go to world missions. Am I reading this right? Is this really the best way to do this? _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 2:31 pm

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Pastor T Member Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 32 Location: North Carolina
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If time is of the essence, why do we have to have this read to us? Could it have not been released and pre-read by all parties involved?		Member Posts: 32 Today at 2:33 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 2:33 pm Post subject:
Per Lamar Vest’s report: The Model stated cuts to State, International, and World Missions. EHM Budget is not addressed and is not a part of the model as set forth in the Substitute Motion per the Executive Committee and Council of 18. Further, according to Lamar Vest’s reading, the only thing that was altered by the Motion to Refer was the time frame to start the cut in 2010 as opposed to 2008. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 2:33 pm

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 2:35 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

I read the report.. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it looks like they are cutting out world missions by reducing the amount sent by churches to 0%.

It seems they are replacing it with a love offering to go to world missions.

Am I reading this right? Is this really the best way to do this?

What you are reading is a recommendation to totally eliminate EHM and to consolidate World Missions into the International Offices.
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 4091
Today at 2:35 pm

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

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Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 2:36 pm Post subject:

Raymond Culpepper:

The Steering Committee is able to observe but not speak or vote.

The Steering Committee is:

Quote:

1. Raymond Culpepper – General Overseer
2. Tim Hill – Assistant GO
3. Mark Williams – Assistant GO
4. David Griffis – Assistant GO
5. Wallace Sibley – Secretary General for COG
6. Dr. Don Walker – Overseer of North Georgia
7. Julian Robinson – Director of Finance for COG
8. Doug LeRoy – Director of World Missions
9. Victor Pagan – Assistant Director of World Missions
10. John Childers – Alabama Overseer
11. Dan Moore – Maryland Pastor
12. R.C. Hugh Nelson – Brooklyn, New York Pastor
13. Darrell Waller – Virginia Pastor
14. Jerry Lawson – Alabama Pastor

That would mean that Dan Moore, Jerry Lawson, Hugh Nelson, and Darrell Waller are unable to participate in the vote or in speech unless they are the first elected member of the State Council.
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

Last edited by Travis Johnson on 4/30/09 2:39 pm; edited 1 time in total

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I like what I am hearing and reading so far.		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 2:36 pm

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I’m on

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 2:36 pm Post subject: I’m on
It’s been 36 minutes and they are still going through precedures. _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 2:36 pm

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 2:38 pm Post subject:

Travis Johnson wrote:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

I read the report.. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it looks like they are cutting out world missions by reducing the amount sent by churches to 0%.

It seems they are replacing it with a love offering to go to world missions.

Am I reading this right? Is this really the best way to do this?

What you are reading is a recommendation to totally eliminate EHM and to consolidate World Missions into the International Offices.

What do you think about that? Is it a good idea? Can you give some pros and cons?
_________________
Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
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http://www.twitter.com/theB3

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 2453
Today at 2:38 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone
Friendly Face

Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 275
Location: Greer, SC

Posted: Today at 2:38 pm Post subject:

Travis Johnson wrote:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

I read the report.. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it looks like they are cutting out world missions by reducing the amount sent by churches to 0%.

It seems they are replacing it with a love offering to go to world missions.

Am I reading this right? Is this really the best way to do this?

What you are reading is a recommendation to totally eliminate EHM and to consolidate World Missions into the International Offices.

So is this the unified budget that got voted down at the last Assembly?
_________________
www.rpfield.com

Last edited by Shane B. Stone on 4/30/09 2:40 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 2:40 pm Post subject:
This is a Unified Budget. This is what the General Assembly of 2006 rejected and why the General Assembly of 2008 overruled the Chairman 950-625. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 2:40 pm

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
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It seems that this is the unified budget		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 2:41 pm

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conquistador Acts-celerater Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 930
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Has anyone found the 21 page report yet? The site says its available but no link is provided. _________________ Romanos 8:37 37 Sin embargo, en todo esto somos más que vencedores por medio de aquel que nos amó.		Acts-celerater Posts: 930 Today at 2:41 pm

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

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Posted: Today at 2:43 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers

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Posted: Today at 3:20 pm Post subject:
These guys seem frustrated because they are having to vote when they don’t know all of the information, and don’t fully understand the info they are given. _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 3:20 pm

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:20 pm Post subject:
Rubber stamp approval???? I’m already wondering how well this thing has been thought out? I feel as though someone has determined how they want it to go & the course has been prepared for the slightest change. Careful Cleveland …the globe is watching and trust is at stake here! _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:20 pm

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
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To Mark Abbot from Travis Johnson: How can the State Office mandate higher percentages from the local church? On what authority? _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:21 pm

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onlyonepurpose
Friendly Face

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 200

Posted: Today at 3:21 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

God bless Rinelander Wisconsin!!

What about Rinelander? That is where my dad is from?

Friendly Face
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Today at 3:21 pm

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:22 pm Post subject:
Mark Abbot from Indiana “I was confused about the reason we came here. I’m not sure why we have four more sessions…” “Are these amendable? Can I make amendments to these?” SUBMITTING A MOTION TO THIS: Recommending that the State Offices be given the opportunity to hold a state vote on the State percentage. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:22 pm

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 3:22 pm Post subject:
If the states vote on how their percent is going to be cut – then they can vote to not cut it at all. That means we can spend more money to go and vote on something else. I know in SC if the state gets a chance to vote on a cut – the ministers I don’t think will cut anything in the state – because Retired Ministers/Campground gets put in the EHM budget. _________________ www.rpfield.com Last edited by Shane B. Stone on 4/30/09 3:24 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 3:22 pm

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:23 pm Post subject:
Mark Abbott’s motion was seconded. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:23 pm

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Is this an indictment?

Steenburgh

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Steenburgh
Acts-celerater

Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 975
Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)

Posted: Today at 3:23 pm Post subject: Is this an indictment?

Quote:

“I was confused about the reason we came here. I’m not sure why we have four more sessions…”

Do we not have a way of keeping on the same page?
_________________
“Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!”

PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net

Church website: FCCModesto.com

Acts-celerater
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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 3:24 pm Post subject:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

God bless Rinelander Wisconsin!!

What about Rinelander? That is where my dad is from?

Darrell Rice was speaking about the cut being detrimental to a church there that has gone from 20 to 40 people in the last year or so, and his region gave that church $20k for a new building.
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Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
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http://www.twitter.com/theB3

Acts Enthusiast
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Today at 3:24 pm

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Re: Go Daryl Rice

Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 4091
Location: Homestead, FL

Posted: Today at 3:25 pm Post subject: Re: Go Daryl Rice

KevinWallace wrote:

The EHM abuse is a myth in his state. I wonder how many states that this is the case

I’ve spoken in first person to Brother Rice. Our conversation was quite different.
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lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com

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Today at 3:25 pm

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kindapentecostal

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kindapentecostal
Friendly Face

Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 306

Posted: Today at 3:26 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

onlyonepurpose wrote:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

God bless Rinelander Wisconsin!!

What about Rinelander? That is where my dad is from?

Darrell Rice was speaking about the cut being detrimental to a church there that has gone from 20 to 40 people in the last year or so, and his region gave that church $20k for a new building.

That’s $1,000 for each person to get saved (assuming that they are new converts).

Seems pricey to me.

Friendly Face
Posts: 306
Today at 3:26 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 3:27 pm Post subject:
Cutshall shaved his mustache and goatee off… _________________ www.rpfield.com		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 3:27 pm

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Phillip Johnson

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Phillip Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 27 Mar 2008 Posts: 2619 Location: Homestead, Florida
Posted: Today at 3:27 pm Post subject:
If I am given a budget of $250 a month in government benefits for food, and I spend that $250 every month of clothes, then I go out and raise $250 each month specifically for food (because my family has to eat) and that’s what I spend it on, then am I not abusing the system? The “EHM abuse” is not a myth. _________________ The Citizen Cane Blog \| myspace \| Twitter		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2619 Today at 3:27 pm

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RE: Go Daryl Rice

KevinWallace

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KevinWallace Friendly Face Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 105
Posted: Today at 3:27 pm Post subject: RE: Go Daryl Rice
Travis, What does that mean? _________________ Once I thought was wrong, but…I was mistaken		Friendly Face Posts: 105 Today at 3:27 pm

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“That we let the churches send in a free will offering.

Tom Sterbens

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Tom Sterbens Acts-celerater Joined: 30 Jul 2006 Posts: 997
Posted: Today at 3:28 pm Post subject: “That we let the churches send in a free will offering.
…are we assume that it is the understanding (foregone conclusion) that Evangelism/Home Missions Fund is being eliminated?		Acts-celerater Posts: 997 Today at 3:28 pm

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I agree with Cutshall

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 3:28 pm Post subject: I agree with Cutshall
He’s on the mark here. Well said. _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 3:28 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:28 pm Post subject:
Bryan Cutshall is speaking in opposition to the amendment because for logistical reasons. The amendment does not offer enough logistics to carry it out. This is what the Body of the General Assembly has asked us to do. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com Last edited by Travis Johnson on 4/30/09 3:28 pm; edited 1 time in total		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:28 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:28 pm Post subject:
Cutshall & Rice seem to dis-agree but yet are doing the same job? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:28 pm

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Phillip

KevinWallace

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KevinWallace Friendly Face Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 105
Posted: Today at 3:28 pm Post subject: Phillip
It is a myth…I know you don’t like it…but the man just cited fact. We need to deal with facts not myths _________________ Once I thought was wrong, but…I was mistaken		Friendly Face Posts: 105 Today at 3:28 pm

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
Posted: Today at 3:29 pm Post subject:
Someone needs to make a motion to add the phrase after September 1, 2014 “,after which EVM will be funded by not less than one fourth of the 5% received by the State/Regional Offices.”		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 3:29 pm

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Cutshall’s response

KevinWallace

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KevinWallace Friendly Face Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 105
Posted: Today at 3:29 pm Post subject: Cutshall’s response
Correct _________________ Once I thought was wrong, but…I was mistaken		Friendly Face Posts: 105 Today at 3:29 pm

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My thoughts

Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:31 pm Post subject: My thoughts
I was under the impression that the results of the impact reports would be an open dialogue & their data would be made public. This comes across like a GA meeting & the motions committee developed a streamlined method to vote for more of the same. _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:31 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:31 pm Post subject:
Question of Privilege by Ron Brown asking if Mark Abbott’s amendment violates the 5 years 5% to 10%. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:31 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 3:31 pm Post subject:
Why is the State’s cut worded differently than the International’s cut. After 5 years shouldn’t the States TOT be 3.75% TOT and 1.25% EHM? _________________ www.rpfield.com		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 3:31 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers Acts Enthusiast Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 2453 Location: Tampa FL
Posted: Today at 3:32 pm Post subject:
I like how Culpepper is moderating. He’s doing well at keeping his personal feelings out of it, and not trying to answer questions in order to interpret motions, etc. _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 3:32 pm

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Steenburgh

KevinWallace

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KevinWallace Friendly Face Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 105
Posted: Today at 3:32 pm Post subject: Steenburgh
I agree…this info should have been reviewed and made available by the EC prior to the meeting. This could be easily percieved as deception. I don’t think it i. The motion says that the EC and Exec council would be the recipients. However they have a responsibility for giving opportunity to see and review impact information. _________________ Once I thought was wrong, but…I was mistaken Last edited by KevinWallace on 4/30/09 3:36 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 105 Today at 3:32 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:34 pm Post subject:
Mike Chapman is speaking that this amendment violates the Substitute Motion. “Nothing prevents State Offices to do fund raising.” “The main reason we need to vote against this is we have been given trust which is very narrow in scope.” “This is to be equally shared between three entitites: World Missions, State Office, and International Offices.” _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:34 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:36 pm Post subject:
motion to amend 23 in favor 101 against. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:36 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:37 pm Post subject:
The way this vote is going they will be done with biz & watching Ugly Betty by 8PM _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:37 pm

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Mandible

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Mandible
Hey, DOC

Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 76
Location: Right behind you

Posted: Today at 3:38 pm Post subject:

Steenburgh wrote:

The way this vote is going they will be done with biz & watching Ugly Betty by 8PM Shocked

Nah, they’re just getting started.

Hey, DOC
Posts: 76
Today at 3:38 pm

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Mandible

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Mandible Hey, DOC Joined: 13 Sep 2006 Posts: 76 Location: Right behind you
Posted: Today at 3:39 pm Post subject:
Essentially, states would have to create a new 2.5% percent.		Hey, DOC Posts: 76 Today at 3:39 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:39 pm Post subject:
States have rights???? Since when????? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:39 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 3:39 pm Post subject:

Steenburgh wrote:

The way this vote is going they will be done with biz & watching Ugly Betty by 8PM Shocked

I would love it if someone went to a mic and asked everyone to hurry up so they could get home in time to watch TV.. That would make my whole week!
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Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
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http://www.twitter.com/theB3

Acts Enthusiast
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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 3:40 pm Post subject:
Ron Martin from DelMarVa would like clarity: Would it be accurate that a state or region can vote to continue with the 2.5%? Raymond Culpepper: “You cannot do that with General Assembly enforcement.” TRAVIS: Am I to assume that if a minister in Michigan or Arkansas decided they wanted to quite paying their extra percentage, they could do so with no repercussion? COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 3:40 pm

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We did that in Kansas

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 3:42 pm Post subject: We did that in Kansas
I was on the state council in KS and we paid a higher percentage to the state than was required by the GA. Without it we would have crippled the work in KS. As a member of the state council in NGA we will meet in two weeks, should the state council, and ultimately the state minister’s meeting entertain such an increase despite the passage of this item? _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/ Last edited by DrHardgrove on 4/30/09 3:43 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 3:42 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone
Friendly Face

Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 275
Location: Greer, SC

Posted: Today at 3:42 pm Post subject:

Travis Johnson wrote:

Ron Martin from DelMarVa would like clarity:

Would it be accurate that a state or region can vote to continue with the 2.5%?

Raymond Culpepper: “You cannot do that with General Assembly enforcement.”

TRAVIS: Am I to assume that if a minister in Michigan or Arkansas decided they wanted to quite paying their extra percentage, they could do so with no repercussion?

COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy.

Seems the door is open if this passes for states with campgrounds or heavy debts to bring to the state ministers a motion on the state level to have additional funding to operate.
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www.rpfield.com

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
Posted: Today at 3:43 pm Post subject:
travis I understood RC to say that a state could not enforce it with any GA mandate.		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 3:43 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 3:43 pm Post subject:

Travis Johnson wrote:

COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy.

I think that’s been hinted at by a few people. Just make up a new fee in order to raise state funds, which totally negates the point of the cut.

What if a state decides to enact a 10% State Office Support Fee?? Churches would be even worse off.
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Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
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http://www.twitter.com/theB3

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Today at 3:43 pm

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Mandible

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Mandible
Hey, DOC

Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 76
Location: Right behind you

Posted: Today at 3:44 pm Post subject:

Shane B. Stone wrote:

Travis Johnson wrote:

Ron Martin from DelMarVa would like clarity:

Would it be accurate that a state or region can vote to continue with the 2.5%?

Raymond Culpepper: “You cannot do that with General Assembly enforcement.”

TRAVIS: Am I to assume that if a minister in Michigan or Arkansas decided they wanted to quite paying their extra percentage, they could do so with no repercussion?

COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy.

Seems the door is open if this passes for states with campgrounds or heavy debts to bring to the state ministers a motion on the state level to have additional funding to operate.

many missions states have additional funds.

Hey, DOC
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Today at 3:44 pm

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Tom Sterbens

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Tom Sterbens
Acts-celerater

Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 997

Posted: Today at 3:44 pm Post subject:

Travis Johnson wrote:

COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy.

Yes he did…HOWEVER…he did also say that it is not enforced by the General Assembly.

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Mandible

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Mandible
Hey, DOC

Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 76
Location: Right behind you

Posted: Today at 3:45 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

Travis Johnson wrote:

COMMENTARY: It would seem to me that Raymond Culpepper just said a State Office could levy any fee a state chose in it State Minister’s Meeting to levy.

I think that’s been hinted at by a few people. Just make up a new fee in order to raise state funds, which totally negates the point of the cut.

What if a state decides to enact a 10% State Office Support Fee?? Churches would be even worse off.

the ministers of the state would have to vote it into effect.

Hey, DOC
Posts: 76
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No Int’l Enforcement Mean?

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 3:46 pm Post subject: No Int’l Enforcement Mean?
I guess the state could pass it, but if the church did not choose to participate there could be no reprecussion from the Int’l HQ. Basically, the only enforcement would be peer pressure from the other ministers. I’d guess that those who do not would not get voted on for state positions (if that matters). _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 3:46 pm

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My internet feed dropped….anybody else?

Tom Sterbens

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Tom Sterbens Acts-celerater Joined: 30 Jul 2006 Posts: 997
Posted: Today at 3:47 pm Post subject: My internet feed dropped….anybody else?
…		Acts-celerater Posts: 997 Today at 3:47 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:47 pm Post subject:
If the state has the right to create a fee does the local church have the right not to contribute? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:47 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:48 pm Post subject:
Mine dropped and came right back on _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:48 pm

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Emhasis was on no Int’l enforcement for state innovations

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 3:49 pm Post subject: Emhasis was on no Int’l enforcement for state innovations
It sounds like other than the effect it may have in terms of political reprecussion within the state but there would be no other effect (such as losing license, or forfeiting pastorate). _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/ Last edited by DrHardgrove on 4/30/09 3:51 pm; edited 2 times in total		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 3:49 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 3:50 pm Post subject:
So if the vote passes – there will no longer be a TOT/EHM split – it will all be one lumped sum…correct? _________________ www.rpfield.com		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 3:50 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:52 pm Post subject:
Goes back to an orig question: does the local clerk send A check to S/O & A check to HQ? Or do we continue to send in 2 checks to both offices? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:52 pm

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Pastor T

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Pastor T Member Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 32 Location: North Carolina
Posted: Today at 3:53 pm Post subject:
Perhaps each state could develop an ala carte cost menu for their services and products. Then we will see what is needed by the local church from the state office.		Member Posts: 32 Today at 3:53 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:54 pm Post subject:
The 2nd motion passes – how does that spell out? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:54 pm

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
Posted: Today at 3:55 pm Post subject:
I am suprised that there have been few motions as it regards to these items. It appears that someone should have asked for a delay in procedure until impact studies could have been distributed and considered. Someone should have amended Item #1 to include a 1/3 for WM (that would be equally shared) instead of 1/4. Someone should have amended Item #2 to include a 1/3 for EVM. (At least a 1/4 to EVM to match the 1/4 to WM. I think there are men in that room that simply want the cut however it comes as long as the 5-5-10 is in tact. Last edited by Billy Humphrey on 4/30/09 3:57 pm; edited 1 time in total		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 3:55 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 3:56 pm Post subject:
Drop the entire ToT program and make each pastor’s credentials fee based which keeps each man accountable for making sure his ministry fees are in place. Sorry, after 14 years with the A/G’s it was really quite simple and this CoG plan is a mixed bag of nuts. _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 3:56 pm

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Go Loran

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 3:59 pm Post subject: Go Loran
It’s gonna get good now. Thank you Loran. It’s time to crack down on those who don’t report and won’t report. It is an issue of integrity. I know that in NGA those who are struggling can call the state office and find compassion in Dr. Walker. But we owe him the courtesy of a call. _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/ Last edited by DrHardgrove on 4/30/09 4:03 pm; edited 2 times in total		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 3:59 pm

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Kyle Morrow

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Kyle Morrow Acts Enthusiast Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1015
Posted: Today at 4:00 pm Post subject:
Go Loran! _________________ You better be nice to me, because one of these days I’m going to be your General Overseer.		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1015 Today at 4:00 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers Acts Enthusiast Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 2453 Location: Tampa FL
Posted: Today at 4:01 pm Post subject:
What sinister movement? Who are these people that hate the COG? I guess he’s talking about Travis and Tom!! _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 4:01 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 4:04 pm Post subject:
Loran is talking about the guys who refuse to support the policies of the CoG that they agreed to. _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 4:04 pm

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Mandible

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Mandible Hey, DOC Joined: 13 Sep 2006 Posts: 76 Location: Right behind you
Posted: Today at 4:04 pm Post subject:
Not much funny to those of us in the movement Brandon		Hey, DOC Posts: 76 Today at 4:04 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers Acts Enthusiast Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 2453 Location: Tampa FL
Posted: Today at 4:05 pm Post subject:
The Internet (Actscelerate) is ecclesiastical pornography. Loran Livingston. _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 4:05 pm

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Shane B. Stone

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Shane B. Stone Friendly Face Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 275 Location: Greer, SC
Posted: Today at 4:05 pm Post subject:
Loran: Internet is Ecclesiastical porn He said to tell everyone that they are knuckleheads, thieves and sinners. _________________ www.rpfield.com Last edited by Shane B. Stone on 4/30/09 4:06 pm; edited 2 times in total		Friendly Face Posts: 275 Today at 4:05 pm

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Oops, He got me.

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 4:05 pm Post subject: Oops, He got me.
Loran is a bit behind the times in understanding the potential of the Internet. Also, remember Loran that the HQ is beaming this out over the Internet. We weren’t invited to the meeting and at least here we can debate the issues. _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/ Last edited by DrHardgrove on 4/30/09 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 4:05 pm

Kyle Morrow

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Kyle Morrow Acts Enthusiast Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1015
Posted: Today at 4:06 pm Post subject:
No, he’s talking about those who don’t those who don’t turn in money with their reports. Maybe me too, because I’m on the internet. Acts can be a good thing, when used the right way. _________________ You better be nice to me, because one of these days I’m going to be your General Overseer.		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1015 Today at 4:06 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 4:06 pm Post subject:
Statement of Privilege by Loran Livingston. (typed as closely as I could) “There has been agony involved from the top to the bottom…I’m troubled in my spirit. We have an integrity problem in the church. And, if we don’t do something about it it will spread like a cancer by people in this denomination who do not love this church….you do not strangle something that you love. There is an attempt to do that very thing. We’ve lost the sense of investing into the Kingdom of God. We have a financial integrity problem in this church… We are $2 million in arrears. Some of this is financial downturn. But not all of it is…. We are going to have to deal with this sinister movement within the church. They’re a bunch of knuckleheads. When you hold back what belongs to God, you are a thief… …”The internet is nothing more than ecclesiastical porn….they need to be saved…they are sinners.” You know who is really hurting in this? Pastors who won’t get any help from the State Office. Somebody’s going to have to file charges. Somebody is going to have to be made an example of. “Jesus is coming. It’s time to stop playing games…” _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 4:06 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 4:07 pm Post subject:
Every time someone points a finger at the camera it comes back to bite them. _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 4:07 pm

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Kyle Morrow

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Kyle Morrow Acts Enthusiast Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1015
Posted: Today at 4:07 pm Post subject:
He didn’t mention Actscelerate one time. Get over yourselves. _________________ You better be nice to me, because one of these days I’m going to be your General Overseer.		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1015 Today at 4:07 pm

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Billy Humphrey

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Billy Humphrey Hey, DOC Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 58
Posted: Today at 4:09 pm Post subject:
I agree with Loran whole heartedly about the financial integrity problem in the church of god. There are pastors who are cheating the system and there are leaders/administrators that are not holding themselves and/or pastors who are cheating the system that should be held accountable. Leaders need to lead with integrity. I really believe that we need greater transparency from the top to the bottom. Last edited by Billy Humphrey on 4/30/09 4:11 pm; edited 1 time in total		Hey, DOC Posts: 58 Today at 4:09 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers
Acts Enthusiast

Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 2453
Location: Tampa FL

Posted: Today at 4:09 pm Post subject:

Kyle Morrow wrote:

He didn’t mention Actscelerate one time. Get over yourselves.

It’s obvious he means Acts.. No one will stand in front of a group like that and say the word “Actscelerate.” They always say “Internet.”

If they refer specifically to Acts, then it implies they check out the site.. And if you read here, you are watching ecclesiastical porn.
_________________
Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com
———
http://www.twitter.com/theB3

Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 2453
Today at 4:09 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 4:09 pm Post subject:
Last year at the GA their were tons of guys who kept referring to the gossip smut on the internet & Actscelerate was mentioned most of the time – ask D. McG. _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 4:09 pm

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conquistador

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conquistador Acts-celerater Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 930
Posted: Today at 4:10 pm Post subject:
I like Loran, but he’s gonna have a stroke if he doesn’t relax. It’s OK to express your love and passion, but its not good to divide the church with such rhetoric. _________________ Romanos 8:37 37 Sin embargo, en todo esto somos más que vencedores por medio de aquel que nos amó.		Acts-celerater Posts: 930 Today at 4:10 pm

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Mandible

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Mandible
Hey, DOC

Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 76
Location: Right behind you

Posted: Today at 4:14 pm Post subject:

Brandon Bowers wrote:

Kyle Morrow wrote:

He didn’t mention Actscelerate one time. Get over yourselves.

It’s obvious he means Acts.. No one will stand in front of a group like that and say the word “Actscelerate.” They always say “Internet.”

If they refer specifically to Acts, then it implies they check out the site.. And if you read here, you are watching ecclesiastical porn.

If he meant Acts he meant those here who have encouraged people to withhold tithes. Start a Revolution!! Remember that topic? you have to contextualize what he said.

Last edited by Mandible on 4/30/09 4:15 pm; edited 1 time in total

Hey, DOC
Posts: 76
Today at 4:14 pm

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Brandon Bowers

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Brandon Bowers Acts Enthusiast Joined: 07 Aug 2008 Posts: 2453 Location: Tampa FL
Posted: Today at 4:14 pm Post subject:
Mike Chapman is awesome! _________________ Renovate Church is on the web! www.renovate540.com ——— http://www.twitter.com/theB3		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 2453 Today at 4:14 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 4:17 pm Post subject:
Mike Chapman’s Statement of Privilege: “The message we just passed had a five year journey to get here…I’m one of the ones who believe…we are bothers who love one another passionately. We want to see this church go forward. I believe we can do more than just cope. I believe we can thrive. Surely, we aren’t just going to drag ourselves through this. We are going to rise up. We are in the midst of great change. One of the challenges we must recognize is that we just voted in a realignment of strategy. We cannot continue to do the same thing we’ve always done. We have an opportunity to refocus. We have an opportunity to create a different way of doing things. We can provide a Kingdom dynamic that works. Now, we have an opportunity to address it because we have to. We will not be a weaker church. The Spirit of God anoints us with power…I’m leaving with excitement into some of the greatest days we have ever seen….we’re going to be creative. We’re not going to just cope. We’re going to thrive. Our greatest days are ahead.” _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 4:17 pm

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Over 2 million down from last year!

DrHardgrove

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DrHardgrove Friendly Face Joined: 01 Jul 2006 Posts: 421 Location: CONYERS, GA
Posted: Today at 4:21 pm Post subject: Over 2 million down from last year!
Wow. At the University where I teach, the income has been down and the staff of the university, from the president down, took a 25% cut in salary until things turn around. The president has resisted letting anyone go, but we have streamlined every event. How about every leader in HQ taking a 25% cut in pay, houseing, etc. Do you think it would add up to 2 million? _________________ Mark E Hardgrove, D.Min. http://conyerscog.org http://drhardgrove.blogspot.com/ Last edited by DrHardgrove on 4/30/09 4:22 pm; edited 1 time in total		Friendly Face Posts: 421 Today at 4:21 pm

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Steenburgh

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Steenburgh Acts-celerater Joined: 23 Sep 2007 Posts: 975 Location: Modesto, California (Nor. Cal)
Posted: Today at 4:22 pm Post subject:
Based on what Julian just said as he quoted Loran, I’m all in favor of sending in our part & here is my honest question: Is missions giving part of doing God’s will? _________________ “Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!” PDSteenburgh@sbcglobal.net Church website: FCCModesto.com		Acts-celerater Posts: 975 Today at 4:22 pm

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Travis Johnson

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Travis Johnson Acts Enthusiast Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 4091 Location: Homestead, FL
Posted: Today at 4:23 pm Post subject:
Maybe many of the reports are not coming in because churches are dying under the weight of our system. Maybe the pastors who don’t have insurance for their families and who are funding the church staying open don’t have the money! Over 50% of our churches have 49 people or less. Is it a stretch to think a lot of those churches just don’t have it and the funds necessary to keep the doors open at the very base level? Cheaters are cheaters, whether they’re in the state office or in the local church are cheaters. But, let’s lay the lumber down when it comes to our bi-vocational men who are sweating and bleeding for their church and doing the best they can without calling them sinners, knuckleheads, and whatever other inflammatory and unedifying commentary we have for them. _________________ lpc l blog l missionalCOG.com Last edited by Travis Johnson on 4/30/09 4:24 pm; edited 1 time in total		Acts Enthusiast Posts: 4091 Today at 4:23 pm

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