Copy of the Detailed Audit Report for the Church of God

Posted on April 29, 2008 by travjohnson

On April 19th, I requested a copy of the most recent COG audit report from Stephen McCall. Today, I received a copy of the “policy-statement-and-agreement” to receive a copy of the detailed audit report for the COG from Denise Watkins/Julian Robinson. The text in the document has the following requirements:

POLICY STATEMENT AND AGREEMENT

I, ________________________, ministerial file no. _______, am a duly credentialed minister in the Church of God. Pursuant to the Church of God General Assembly Minutes regarding “International Offices Space,” as passed at the 68th General Assembly, I hereby request a copy of the CPA audit report for the Church of God, and am willing to pay cost for same ($10).
I further agree as follows: I am an ordained minister or pastor of the Church of God, and am making this request for a copy of the above material in connection with my services as a minister in the Church of God. I agree that my receipt of this material will not be used for any purposes other than my own personal information, and shall not be reproduced or distributed to any member of the press, media, or any other outside sources or for any purpose other than my review of these materials as an ordained minister or pastor in the Church of God.

I want to get a copy of the report. I’d like to look through it. I’m not looking to republish it. But I’d like to discuss it. I’m not sure if the requirement is saying that I cannot discuss it here. If I am unable to discuss the information, I’m not sure how I feel about that. Any thoughts or advice?

Filed under: church of god

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39 Responses to “Copy of the Detailed Audit Report for the Church of God”

  1. Phil Hoover, on April 29th, 2008 at 11:41 am Said:

    It seems as though the Church of God is requesting that you make a confidentiality statement concerning the CPA audit…

    If you can’t share it or discuss it, why have it?

  2. travjohnson, on April 29th, 2008 at 11:46 am Said:

    If that is correct and I sign it, would that preclude me from discussing items I already have knowledge of?

  3. jonathanstone, on April 29th, 2008 at 12:58 pm Said:

    Travis, I’m not sure what informatin is in an audit. So, that limits my perspective here. I operate from a general principle that as Christians we have nothing to hide. So, I’m not into keeping a lot of secrets. However, I will say that there are certain things with any large organization that are better handled ‘behind closed doors’ so to speak. (And yes, I know I sound like I just contracdicted myself–but the former is my leaning with the latter keeping my dialectical balance). For example, I would not vote on a measure to send out audits to the major press outlets. I’m not sure that any goober in the world should be able to google and find all of the CoG fiscal information that is otherwise available to the pastors who ask for it. So, from that perspective I can understand the agreement they are asking you to sign.

    This interweb thingy that Al Gore invented is as public as it gets. I’m sure there are certain topics that I would not engage in a public conversation about. Is this one of them? I don’t know.

  4. tomsterbens, on April 29th, 2008 at 3:49 pm Said:

    2002 Minutes of the General Assembly of the Church of God

    S9 Secretary General

    II. Duties and Authorities

    The secretary general shall…

    4. Have an audit of financial records and furnish the International General Assembly a statement of all receipts and disbursements, assets and liabilities, such statements to be prepared by a certified public accountant annually.

  5. travjohnson, on April 29th, 2008 at 4:16 pm Said:

    The email I just sent:

    Julian or Denise,

    Thank you for the response. I read through the document and am left with some uncertainty concerning what I am able to do with the information and additionally how it may limit my discussion of information I already have. Am I required to sign this to access the audit report?

    Regards,

    travis

  6. Matt Boyd, on April 29th, 2008 at 9:08 pm Said:

    Tom,
    From your excerpt for the minutes I would deduce that every member of the COG is entitled to a copy of the audit. Is not every member of the COG also a part of the International General Assembly?

  7. jerrylawson, on April 29th, 2008 at 10:45 pm Said:

    Travis,

    I got the exact same document that you got today. I have signed it, had it notorized and will be sending it back in with my $10. I have decided to honor the “letter of the agreement”. I’ll just leave it at that until I get the document in my hands………

  8. Darrell Buttram, Jr, on May 1st, 2008 at 7:56 am Said:

    So, if everybody who wanted to discuss it were to sign off on the agreement and a password protected thread were set up for the discussion would that be legal?

  9. travjohnson, on May 1st, 2008 at 8:34 am Said:

    Darrell,

    A. I think only one person would have to sign off on it.

    B. I think the confidentiality agreement may not be fully appropriate as it cites portions of the Minutes that no longer exist.

    C. Even when it did exist, the Minutes did and still do require an audit report to be provided to the entire International General Assembly with no requirement of a confidentiality agreement.

    So, while someone can voluntarily subject themselves to that confidentiality agreement, the Minutes do not require it. Further, it is beyond the scope of our denominational offices to require it.

  10. Jonathan Stone, on May 1st, 2008 at 8:48 am Said:

    Travis, have you received a response to the email you posted in the comment on April 29th?

  11. travjohnson, on May 1st, 2008 at 9:08 am Said:

    no.

  12. travjohnson, on May 1st, 2008 at 9:09 am Said:

    Here is the email I sent in addition to that yesterday:

    Julian,

    Pursuant to a conversation I had with Tom Sterbens sparked by these discussion threads on MissionalCOG.com ( http://missionalcog.wordpress.com/2008/04/29/copy-of-the-detailed-audit-report-for-the-church-of-god/) and on Actscelerate (http://www.actscelerate.com/viewtopic.php?t=29840), I have been unable to locate the referenced requirement from the “Policy Statement and Agreement” in the 2006 COG General Assembly Minutes governing access to the audit report. Further, it seems that the requirement of confidentiality is a requirement not addressed by the Minutes in any form.

    Please reference the most recent statement mandating the supply of the requested report per instructions of S9.II. Duties and Responsibilities 4. “Have an audit of financial records and furnish the International General Assembly a statement of all receipts and disbursements, assets and liabilities, such statements to be prepared by a certified public accountant annually.”

    I do not want to release information from the detailed annual COG audit report to the media per concern expressed in the “Policy Statement and Agreement” document. But, I would like to continue to discuss items I am already aware of and items of interest openly with my peers. The confidentiality agreement seems to preclude that and even limit the discussion of information already in my possession.

    Please forward a copy of the most recent COG audit report according to the parameters of the most recent General Assembly Minutes which has been duly requested by me.

    Warmest regards,

    Travis Johnson

  13. Jonathan Stone, on May 1st, 2008 at 12:28 pm Said:

    “Warmest Regards”

    Nice!

  14. Darrell Buttram, Jr, on May 1st, 2008 at 2:39 pm Said:

    Travis,

    I wonder if there needs to be an ammendment made to the minutes that would reinforce the requirement by giving more specific direction in how to satisfy that obligation.

    Obviously they are not fullfilling the requirement properly, but must be following some previously established precedence.
    You’re right that this is not within their scope of power. This makes me question their justification and makes me want to know how this precedent came about to begin with.

  15. travis johnson, on May 1st, 2008 at 3:07 pm Said:

    Jon,

    I do regard Julian Robinson warmly…just want to access some info.

  16. Jonathan Stone, on May 1st, 2008 at 8:27 pm Said:

    Travis, I’m glad your warm regards are genuine. I’m not surprised, Julian Robinson is a very fine man. It just struck me a little funny for some reason.

    I agree with Darrell, something is kind of irritating about this, and it’s raising questions in my mind. The lack of response, or at least delay in response, is making the irritation and the questions grow.

  17. Chris Stiles, on May 1st, 2008 at 9:22 pm Said:

    Not only do they request you to sign a form promising where you promise to keep the audit private, but you need to have said form notarized? Please tell me this is just a joke. Please?

  18. travjohnson, on May 2nd, 2008 at 3:37 pm Said:

    UPDATE:

    My question regarding the privacy statement and whether or not I have to sign it has been referred to Dr. Walker since he is the Secretary General. I received an email from Dr. Walker saying that it is on the agenda for the May 12-14 International Executive Committee meeting to be discussed in order to provide an appropriate response.

  19. jerrylawson, on May 2nd, 2008 at 9:14 pm Said:

    Trav,

    Just for the sake of clarity, is your question going before the Executive Committee or the Executive Council?

  20. travjohnson, on May 2nd, 2008 at 9:46 pm Said:

    executive committee

  21. Bill, on May 7th, 2008 at 9:50 pm Said:

    Travis,

    It is my feeling and experience that the leaders of our church will be happy to help you find whatever information you are looking for. As you might expect, there would be some policy (and it may need updating) for release of information as to who gets it and the notarizing of the documents are likely just part of the new day of litigation and potentiality of suits. I just tried to change my cable bill authorizations and it required a notarized statement indicating that I had given permission to change the billing dates and address! Ugh–lawyers! Within an organization like ours, it would unwise to throw caution to the wind and just dump information to anyone. Not everyone loves the church as you do!

  22. Matt Boyd, on May 7th, 2008 at 10:22 pm Said:

    Bishop Isaacs,

    I have requested a copy of the Audit three times since the 22nd of April and have yet to even get a response.

    I don’t know what to think and don’t want to think the worst. Should I send a certified letter to Dr Walker?

    God Bless!
    Matt

  23. travis johnson, on May 8th, 2008 at 5:46 am Said:

    Bill,

    First, I have to tell you- Jason rocked our website…can’t wait to go public with it. I think it is one of the most interactive, sweet designs I’ve seen…very nice.

    Second and concerning the confidentiality agreement and financial disclosure, I would expect that we would at least have the same level of disclosure as a for-profit corporation. I can go to Hoovers.com and get salary information of officers and detailed financials without even being a shareholder of the company. I used to routinely go there, snag financials, and use them to identify corporate weaknesses, leveraging that info to navigate a multi-million dollar technology sale.

    On first meetings with Novartis, Harley Davidson, Gannett (Miami Herald, Philadelphia Inquirer, etc….), VWR Scientific, and others, I sat down with VP Marketing, CFO, and VP IT knowing what they made and what they spent the previous year in the particular area I was discussing. I also had extensive trending data available.

    That info was available to competitors, employees, and anyone that cared to see it. But, with the COG, Jerry Lawson an ordained Bishop leading one of our most prominent churches, Matt Boyd an ordained bishop and Captain in the USAF serving as a chaplain, and I cannot even get a peek unless we sign an oath not to talk about what we find.

    What kind of financial standard is that?

    Beyond having parity in disclosure with secular institutions, I have to wonder how are we supposed to know if it is accurate that we’re out of money in Cleveland? How do we find out if we make an informed decision regarding how the tithe of tithe is cut?

  24. jonathanstone, on May 8th, 2008 at 8:54 am Said:

    Bill et al, I would have to agree with Travis. At first glance the ‘hold up’ in Cleveland seems understandable. However, the reality is that it seems ‘understandable’ to us because we’ve had the system ingrained into us. This is not, in fact, a healthy way to operate an organization of this size. I don’t think anyone is malicious in it. However, I do believe it represents a foundational flaw in our mindset.

    Today’s standard in business is ‘permanent whitewater.’ The organization that is prepared to thrive in a constantly changing environment wins. Every organization is a learning organization (a la “The Fifth Discipline”), and so the organization that creates an environment conducive to constant learning wins. I know that as a church we are not in a competition, but these basic principles that are being shown to us in the global world of business ought to be helping us understand how to best operate in the 21st century.

    I find it ironic that we have so many fiscal conservatives (politically speaking) in our denomination, and yet we continue to buy into this mindset of denominational regulation. Everything must be ran ‘through the proper channels,’ etc. I think most people that encounter this type of bureacracy over such little things tend to get discouraged and eventually drop it. More ironic is this, normally we’re not talking about someone analyzing data that could be perceived as ‘potentially damaging’ (which, as Travis said, should be readily available no matter the motives), but rather is someone genuniely trying to offer services or ministry. But the question/offer being brought bounces around so long that people eventually just walk away and the administrators are just glad that they don’t have to ‘deal with it.’ I’ve seen this happen more than once! It’s rediculous.

    We do the same thing in the local church by the way. And that to me is a sign of how embedded this mindset really is. I know we (a local church) cannot release any random clown with a ‘burden’ into ministry. However, don’t put your members through an 8-week training course just so they can be ‘released’ to play basketball with some kids on Wednesday nights. At the grassroots level (so-called ‘laity’ ;) we have an army of Chrisitan soldiers waiting to be released. This army could change the world with its radical love for Christ and His mission. But that giant will continue to sleep as long as we continue to need ‘waivers’ and ‘committee meetings’ and ‘notarized documents’ for even the simplest things (which is already outlined by the minutes for goodness sakes!!). Anyway, I know that might seem like a large jump to connect this little document to the release of our people into the mission of the church….but I honestly believe that they are inherently connected.

  25. JayRhodes, on May 8th, 2008 at 5:02 pm Said:

    Travis,
    I was wondering were you told that you would be given an answer to the privacy question after the EC meeting on the 14th? When I read about the situation you have been through I must conclude that one of the major problems that we have in our church is the lact of communication from Cleveland. Being in business for many years there was no way a share holder would continue to invest money in a company where the financial information was not release to them. How as ministers can we help our organization grow and become stronger if we have no idea what is going on or where the need is in the first place?
    Lack of knowledge leads to confusion which leads to rumors. All the EC has to do is allow the Ordained Ministers to see where the money is going. To me this issue brings out a greater problem that we have in our church and that is the gulf that is between Cleveland and the Local church.

  26. Matt Boyd, on May 9th, 2008 at 5:37 pm Said:

    I just got a call this afternoon. Dennis Watkins office had tried to reply back to me concerning the Audit report and the e-mail server on the Air Force base kept rejecting the e-mail and sending it back to them.

  27. Unity « Missional Church of God, on May 22nd, 2008 at 10:50 pm Said:

    [...] like I’m winning a popularity contest right now…definitely not getting cool points for requesting audit reports and objecting to signing confidentiality agreements that cite defunct passages from 8 years General [...]

  28. travjohnson, on May 22nd, 2008 at 10:58 pm Said:

    The request to receive the audit report without signing the confidentiality agreement which cited defunct passages of the 68th General Assembly Minutes was denied per the email I received from Dr. Walker.

  29. J. W. Church, on May 27th, 2008 at 7:38 pm Said:

    Travis

    How can it be denied? You requested audit which is in your right according to the by laws. Please refresh my memory to where the bylaws say that you have to request a copy and sign a conf. agreement? Are you going to press this further?

  30. jerrylawson, on May 28th, 2008 at 9:00 am Said:

    Here are the facts concerning the “Privacy Statement & Agreement” that a minister is required to sign to get a copy of the Audit:

    1. The measure allowing a minister to request an audit was adopted at the 2000 General Assembly in conjunction with the construction of the General Offices.

    2. The requirement to sign a “Privacy Statement & Agreement” was never adopted by the General Assembly (or even discussed). This was decided by the Executive Committee at an EC meeting in September of 2000.

    3. This third point is just my opinion based on what I have learned. I THINK that although this “audit measure” was only created as a result of the construction of the new General Offices, it became policy for any instance that a minister wants to see an audit. Also, the EC’s meeting that requires a signed privacy document, must have set a precident that is to be followed any time a minister wants to see the audit.

  31. J. W. Church, on May 28th, 2008 at 10:18 am Said:

    Jerry,

    I thought that as long as a the COG as been in existence that any licensed minister could request to see the books of the organization? Is it that people are requesting the audit that was adopted in 2000 and not just a copy of the detailed year end financials?

  32. jerrylawson, on May 28th, 2008 at 2:51 pm Said:

    I think you are correct that there has always been a measure requiring the Secretary General to provide some sort of documentation for any minister. However, if you ask for that information today, you will be routed to the “Policy Statement & Agreement” (also called privacy statement and agreement).

    This measure came about in the 2000 Assembly as people were interested in seeing financials relating to construction of the new offices. Shortly after the Assembly, the new EC drafted the paperwork we are required to sign.

  33. J. W. Church, on May 28th, 2008 at 3:04 pm Said:

    Ok I see. Did I read somewhere that you were going to sign it? Since you can not discuss the report did you sign and return it? And did you receive any packages from the Southeast corner of TN. LOL

  34. Matt Boyd, on May 28th, 2008 at 11:06 pm Said:

    Here is my corrispondence with the Secretary General today:

    Brother Walker,

    Could you please send me documentation of the decision of the Executive Council where they decided that it would be unfair to others if Travis Johnson or others did not sign the Privacy Statement required to receive the Audit. Is this decision to enforce rules in expired minutes a legal decision since the General Assembly is the highest governing body in our denomination? It would seem to me that it is the same as enforcing the ban on going to a movie theater, that is no longer in our minutes. Is there a way to object to this decison as illegal?

    I would like to have a current copy of the International Church Budget and expenditures. I am requesting the document that is several hundered pages, that Bishop Bill Isaacs mentioned on MissionalCOG.com, not the 6 page audit. Since I am unfamiliar with the format of your reports, could you please send a breakdown of any miscellaneous categories (what these expenses are)? In addition, if these things are not contained in the budget, please send specific salaries, budgets and expenditures for all departments and positions in the international offices.

    Feel free to contact me at the office number below or on my cell at …

    God Bless!

    //SIGNED//

    MATTHEW F. BOYD, Ch, Capt, USAF
    Protestant Chaplain, 49 FW/HC
    Holloman AFB NM, 88330
    DSN: 572-7211 COM:(575)572-7211

    His response:

    In response to your recent email regarding the audit report/privacy statement procedure the Executive Committee decision reads:

    In response to your inquiry, the International Executive Committee

    agreed that in order to maintain equity for all involved, it will be

    necessary to sign the attached form to receive the information you request.

    This action reflects the sentiments of the International Executive Council by virtue of the Executive Committee. Therefore, I will be glad to bring your Email of May 28, 2008, to the attention of the Executive Committee in the next meeting scheduled for July 8-10, 2008 for their consideration.

    Since I am unsure of what Bishop Bill Isaacs referenced, I cannot address that part of your Email without additional information.

    Sincerely,

    Paul L. Walker, Ph.D.

    Secretary General

    Church of God International Offices

    Cleveland, TN May 28, 2008

  35. jerrylawson, on May 29th, 2008 at 8:56 am Said:

    I did receive the 16-page audit of funds for the year ending August 31, 2007. There are some enlightening facts revealed in it. I have several questions to ask, and I am compiling my list now.

    I do not want anyone to get the wrong idea. I am not looking for a “gotcha” in the audit, nor did I see one. I am only looking to better understand the financial picture of the COG so that I will be fully informed at General Assembly when the finances are sure to be a central theme.

    I have communicated to the EC that the information that I have received is lacking in specifics and that I would like a more detailed understanding of the distribution of funds. I am currently awaiting their reply. To be continued…

  36. J. W. Church, on June 6th, 2008 at 10:01 pm Said:

    I have done some researching and come up with some interesting information that I would like to discuss with fellow COG ministers only. So if you would like to know please email me for how to get the password for the CHURCH section of my blog.

  37. Matt Boyd, on June 6th, 2008 at 10:43 pm Said:

    J.W.
    Where do I find your e-mail address?

  38. Chris Stiles, on June 8th, 2008 at 3:42 pm Said:

    J.W.,

    I too would like your email address.

    Mine is chris@chrisstiles.tv

  39. jwchurch, on June 23rd, 2008 at 1:28 am Said:

    I have made it back please refer to my blog

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